Re: To HANYA and SOLOVEY

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: : : : It appears that nothing is happening with the CIS. According to a 1999/2000 summary of organizations which I obtained the other day at the UN, thus far the CIS has an agreement on a treaty *proposal* on military union, and a United Trade Zone (customs union) that was signed by only Russia, Ukraine, and Belarus. In case anyone doesn't know, the CIS includes each of the former republics of the Soviet Union except for Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania. : : : : Other than the above, there have been a number of committees set up within the framework of the CIS, such as environment and natural resources, Intergovernmental Council for Oil and Gas (we all know how well this committee has worked to benefit Ukraine ...duh ... oh yeah - Russia keeps raising energy prices, and Ukraine keeps paying them), anti-monopoly council, ecological council, Inter-state Rail Committee, radionavigation, and the like. : : : : In other words, the CIS doesn't begin to approach an organization on the scale of the EU, and if Ukraine should manage to get its foot in the door in the the EU, the CIS agreement becomes even more marginalized. : : : : However, I can't see Ukraine choosing to exit the CIS without having the garantee of a presence in the European Union. It must choose to ally itself either with its neighbors in the East or its neighbors in the West, and if the EU rejects Ukraine, there is no other choice than to form strong bonds with the fSU countries once again. I suspect that Ukraine is just biding its time to see how well it is received in the West. : : : RE: TO HANYA -- Your and other nationalistic Ukrainians' approaches toward Rusyns are not better than the imperialistic and nationalistic approaches of some Russians toward Ukrainians. : : What about Rusyns? Rusyns are part of Ukrainian nation, at least the ones in Ukraine are. They don't seem to have any separatist movement and the truth is that many true Ukrainian patriots (as you call them, in a "good" Soviet tradition, the nationalists) are Rusyns. Rusyns in Ukraine are pro-Ukrainian more than some Ukrainians are. : : > As a matter of fact, you, Ukranian-Rusich, Mirko and other Ukranian chauvinists on this board have your mind so much clouded that you cannot see beyond your trident. Oh Yes, the nasty Europeans, you should let Ukraine to join the EU with all our : : ^^^ : : Are you Ukrainian yourself? Have you ever lived in Ukraine? If so, very strange, because according to my experience with Ukrainian Rusyns, you don't reflect ANY of their opinions... : : > corrupted hetjmans of gangster's mentality so that we can effectively destroy the rest of civilized Europe. Also, the nasty Russians give us oil for free because we will keep steeling it from the pipelines. : : : If you are sincere to help Ukraine start with restoring in this country the work ethic, eliminating the parasitic and inefficient bureaucracy, establishing the rule of low, independent press and judicial system so that it works. And this should work even when the President or a group of hetjmans in Verchovna Rada think differently. Aren't you horrified with facts that, in the current Ukraine, 15-year-old girls are prostitutes and gangsters are role models for teen-age boys? This developed during the years of vilna Ukraina. : : Are you implying that we should go back to being Malorossia? : : > Can you tell me a period in history of Ukraine that this country with best soil for agriculture at least in Europe was importing grain from Kazakhstan, : : true : : > Poland, : : ?? where did you get that information? : : >Slovakia : : ???? : : >and Hungary? Are you able to wake up? It easy to blame others for all what takes place in Ukraine but it does not solve enything. : : What will on your opinion? : : >Sincerely, Joe : : : : Ihor Solovey : RE: To HANYA and SOLOVEY: You are talking about those Rusyns who became Ukrainians in the end of 19 and beginning of 20th. century during the time of Ivan-Franko. I’m talking about those Rusyns located from Karpatian Mountains west who were represented by Fr. Duchnovych. Well, the latecomers are always overly nationalistic and that’s why a number of them from Galicia and Bukovina served as famous guards in Nazi Concentration Camps. The Rusyns what I’m talking about are those who were fighting against the Nazi Germany in Czechoslovak army stationed in USSR. They had been fighting, starting from Bela Cerkva up to Prague, and sacrificing their life not for vilna Ukraina or brutal Stalin’s annexation of Podkarpatska Rus (Transcarpathia) to USSR, but for democratic Czechoslovakia. Unlike converted Rusyns into Ukrainians, the Rusyns in Podkarpatska Rus had experienced to live in a highly developed democratic country for 20 years. In addition, you are ignoring the following documents: a)US Department of State, Human Rights Reports for 1999-Ukraine; b)the European Centre for Minority Issues (ECMI), Inter-Ethnic Relations in Transcarpathian Ukraine 1999; c)T.Trier (ECMI) Focus on Transcarpathia, 1999; : The amount of grain bought from the western neighbors of Ukraine was 350 000 t. (see the Slovak press SME, Novy Cas or Pravda or you can make an inquire in authorities in Uzhorod or Lviv, but not in members of RUCH. Those gays won’t tell you the truth in the name of “vilna Ukraina”.). This amount is not too much, and it’s easier to deliver it to Transcarpathia or Lviv oblast from the west than from Kazakhstan. What is striking that Slovakia had produced so much that it could even contribute to this transaction, although 70% of its territory are mountains and general perception is that its agriculture is inefficient due to socialistic past. (The agriculture sector of Slovakia represents a major obstacle for EU entry.) Than obvious question is, how bad is it in Ukraine? My suggestion – in order to make efficient reforms, one has to know exactly the facts. (see the recent IMF investigation). Patriotism is nice but not if it goes in expense of democracy and the rule of low. Take a look on Slovakia’s problems and the role of the former prime minister Vladimir Meciar or Slobodan Milosevic and Jugoslavia. The vast majority of former communists picked up fast the nationalistic slogans and flags, and they are ardent patriots. : Joe

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