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Music and Art at the Ukrainian Institute of America
Posted by Alex on September 17, 2005 at 11:35:47:
In Reply to: Re: MTL - when did you write the following? posted by Just wondering on September 17, 2005 at 05:39:19:
Read my first post on this subject (there it is...)
"I am Jewish myself and I really want to move back to Kiev from Canada but incidents like that give pause."
I am neither MTL, as mseidner, as Gazprom, etc. I did not post even one of the comments you have specified here. All my posts on this forum were always civilized and had to do with the Russian language situation in Ukraine (as Alex) and some comments regarding the situation in Russia (see below - regarding possibility of a revolution in Russia). Yes, my opinions are different from yours and but they do not include contempt or hate for the Ukrainian people and I have NEVER and I repeat NEVER used that as a bashing ground for Ukrainans or anyone else on this forum and in general. People have different opinions and they are free to express them anytime as long as they do not offend others. And yes I clearly do not support comments such as "All Ukrainians in W.Ukraine should be killed if you can't kill all Ukrainians in W.Ukraine, then in 20 years everyone in Ukraine will be speaking Ukrainian. Russians will not allow this. Ukraine must return to Russia as soon as possible." or "I admit to being vile, I'm an angry guy to, angry about what I see here. ... I just like to taunt rednecks like you!!! So calm down. See the taunts worked!!!". However let me say this and I have said that time and time again in my posts here: Independence is not only a right, it comes with a responsibility. Just like Ukraine has every reason to be proud of its achievments, its people and its culture, it also needs to take responsibility for things in the country that need improvement. Antisemitism and bigotry is a problem in Ukraine that needs to be tackled. However and this is where my my distaste for hardcore nationalism comes in, many people in Ukraine refuse to recognize the problem. They say: Oh this problem does not exist (it just hooliganism of course), accuse the Russians (see skinhead scam came from Russia) or the Jews themselves as the openly Anti-Semitic MAUP University did (they actually awarded a doctorate to David Duke! - how more sick can you get: http://www.davidduke.com/index.php?p=394#more-394). If you live in a democratic society it is a right and a responsibility to question or leaders or point to certain problems in the country so that the leadership can tackle it. So I post something regarding Anti-Semitism in Ukraine what do I get called? An anti-Ukrainian bigot that has enjoyed greatly posting messages "to taunt and revile Ukrainians" without even knowing who I am? Read your own posts my friend you called me anti-Ukrainian for saying that Anti-Semitism is a problem. This is not unlike what Stalin did to Ukrainians when they complained about the represivness of the Ukrainian (he called them traitors of the Revolution). You call yourself a Ukrainian patriot and yet you refuse to rectify certain very important issues in your country that have to do with global human rights and make it even better. I think that many nationalists like you have to look in the mirror.
: : I love Ukrainians and Ukraine and as I have previously mentioned, I want to go back there.
: When exactly did you write this? I must have missed this but - you did write the following -
: "In Ukraine, Ukrainian nationalism has been defined for only one ethnic group and leaves out the others, it's not a unifying force, just the opposite. I consider nationalism to be anti-Ukrainian, being Ukrainian should not be based on ethnicity, this is ethnic chauvinism."
: this is great - being patriotic is anti-UA
: "The mass starvation of Ukraine and southern Russia happened when Stalin transferred food from rural to urban areas."
: this is not why/how it happened - it happened to subjugate and/or annihilate large segments of populations in order to effect a land grab - collectivization.
: "I admit to being vile, I'm an angry guy to, angry about what I see here. ... I just like to taunt rednecks like you!!! So calm down. See the taunts worked!!!"
: you taunt and provoke - why? because you hate UA nationalists.
: "Sorry fer bein one-a-dem sabotagin' provacateurs."
: "All Ukrainians in W.Ukraine should be killed if you can't kill all Ukrainians in W.Ukraine, then in 20 years everyone in Ukraine will be speaking Ukrainian. Russians will not allow this. Ukraine must return to Russia as soon as possible."
:
: You post as MTL, as mseidner, as Gazprom, etc. and have enjoyed greatly posting messages to taunt and revile Ukrainians on this message board many times all while stating that you are not anti-UA but this is the first time that you say that you "love" UA, so pardon my skepticism. Could you point me to the message where you wrote that? Thanks.