Posted by AndriyMax on July 31, 2002 at 03:13:05:
In Reply to: Re: RE: UPA & NAZIS posted by Kraweckin on July 30, 2002 at 15:27:19:
Та хоч із чортом - аби лишень незалежність здобути для свого народу.
Уже з 1940 - почалися розбіжності між Гітлером і ОУН (не УПА, яка була пізніше створена).
: : : : Тим не менше, усе прогресивне людство схвалює діяльність УПА.
: : : :::Do you y have in mind the former members of SS and SA?
: : (((Ні, я маю на увазі світову громаду, більшість відомих газет та інформаційних служб схвально відгукнулися на новину про "ніби-то" бажання українського уряду прирівняти ветеранів УПА до ветеранів Червоної Армії.
: :::Ordinary soldiers of both UPA and Red Army are one thing, the high ranking officers giving orders and dealing with security are another story. See comments above regarding Roman Shukhevich et al.,. and his collaboration with fuhrer Henlein of Sudeten Deutsche.
:
: Крім того, ті ж самі вояки УПА (і навіть СС "Галичина", хоча мова зараз не про них) після встановлення Радянського режиму отримали притулок у зовсім НЕ (все ж, погодьтеся) нацистській Великій Британії.)))
: ::: More than one Nazi find refuge in North America and GB.
: :
: : : : Окрім зграйки брехливих польських, російських, тощо радикалів.
: : : :::Who are Derzhavnyky-Natsionalisty, not radical groups?
: : (((Залежить, що Ви маєте на увазі під цим терміном)))
: ::: The same as you, namely the "зграйки брехливих радикалів" that unfortunately represent substantially larger "зграйки" among Derzhavnyky-Natsionalisty , though Ukraine is also a large country.
: : : : Адже думка офіційних польських посадовців чи інтелектуалів є зовсім іншою.
: :::: As long as new evidence emerges about atrocities from UPA activities.
: Why do not you, Ukrainians, do a thorough inquiry into this matter? To find Roman Shukhevich boys in Wermacht's uniforms of Hitler's army posing in the center of Vienna in 1939 (Austria part of Third Reich) took me 20 minutes.
: : : :::For sure, particularly about SS Division of Galitsien.
: : (((У даний момент ми вели мову про УПА, а не про СС "Галичина")))
: ::: It easier to discriminate between ordinary soldiers of UPA and SS Halychyna than between high ranking officers of UPA and officers of the latter.
:
: : : : : IT DOES NOT CHANGE THE FACT OF ROMAN SHUKHEVICH BEING IN THE NAZI WERMACHT UNIFORM IN 1939. BESIDES UPA, CIA COLLABORATED WITH OTHER NAZIS USING M16 AS WELL. SO WHAT? ARE M16, COLLABORATION WITH CIA and ANTI-COMMUNISM SUFFICIENT FOR DENAZIFICATION OF UPA and OTHER NAZI ORGANIZATIONS?
: : : : : : Excerpts From:
: : : : : : "http://www.scotlandonsunday.com"?"http://www.scotlandonsunday.com"
: : : : : : Sun 21 Jul 2002 ?
: : : : : : THE remnants of a 100,000-strong army which battled the Nazis and then the Soviet Union in the Ukraine will receive the same pension rights as Red Army veterans, the government announced last week.
: : : : : : The Ukrainian Insurgent Army (UPA) turned its guns against the Russians after the defeat of the Nazis and were supported by British agents until they were crushed in 1953.
: : : : : : Members of Ukraine’s Russian minority and communists condemned the recognition of the fighters who killed tens of thousands of Russian and Ukrainian communists with the help of MI6 and the CIA.
: : : : : : The UPA, led by Roman Shukhevych, and operating from bases in forests and an extensive network of secret underground bunkers, battled against Soviet forces and carried out assassinations against Communist officers and officials. The Russians, frustrated at not being able to wipe out the guerrillas carried out vicious reprisals against the civilian population, many of whom were tortured, executed or sent to languish in Soviet prison camps.
: : : : : : The UPA lost many of their fighters but eluded and destroyed many more of their enemies and made it through to German areas occupied by Britain and the US. Some of those who survived settled in Britain while most made their way to America and Canada